#anti baelon targaryen

[atopvisenyashill]

i have this theory that if more of her children had lived (especially gael), alysanne would have expressed anger at baelon for going along with stealing rhaenys' inheritance.

but at this point she literally only had baelon, so she decided to swallow her pride and support him.

what do you think?

Well we actually don't know if Alysanne expressed anger at Baelon over this; the narrative is largley silent on Baelon's reaction to being named Prince of Dragonstone and completely silent on how Alysanne treats Baelon, Viserys, and Daemon afterwards. Also, Gael dies several years after Baelon was named; in fact, Gael dies two years after Rhaenyra is born, so Viserys and Baelon are already well entrenched in the capital. Alysanne is also not shy about expressing her anger at her husband in this time period and it seems implied she doesn't really express any affection for Viserys during or even after the second quarrel; there's no mention as to whether she returns from dragonstone for the wedding, whether she's there for rhaenyra's birth, whether she had a hand in viserys or aemma's match even - and we still don't know if daemon's match with rhea royce is the result of alysanne, baelon, or jaehaerys either. beyond that, alysanne is actively campaigning for rhaenys at several points so i don't think it's out of the realm of possibility to say she is pissed off at baelon - it's just that none of the biographers give a shit about that aspect of her life, because that complicates her from the perfect mother, perfect queen, who uses soft power, to a woman who is deeply hurt and betrayed by the two men she is shown to be closest by, and that it completely ruins the twilight years of her life.

with daella, alyssa, and viserra all long dead, aemon recently dead, and long barred from seeing saera, yeah, all alysanne has left is baelon and gael, along with maegelle and vaegon, but i do think that's part of the problem; both times, i get the sense that maegelle is like,,,,basically gaslighting her mother into going back to jaehaerys, and maegelle is the only person alysanne really has left talk to, with gael being kind of an eternal child and baelon being part of the reason she's so upset. so i actually kind of disagree here - i think alysanne likely did voice anger at baelon, and baelon, alongside maegelle, basically told her to just get the hell over it, and it took several years of alysanne slowly getting more sick, slowly losing more of her memory, losing her physical connection to her dragon, and probably rewriting her own memories of her relationship with jaehaerys before she finally was broken down enough by the ungrateful brats she had left to "forgive" jaehaerys and come back home, but even then, it seems unlikely she and jaehaerys were at all close past this point, and we get very little mention of alysanne being close to baelon again. i think towards the end of her life, alysanne really was just not in contact with much of her family besides gael, rhaenys, and maegelle, and she's being like, actively manipulated in some heinously elder abusey ways by maegelle on top of being an older mother.

[ride-thedragon]

I used to love Baelon and Alyssa until I realized that if, as a child, someone told me I was 'made for someone', how deeply that would affect me.

Then he's the father of Daemon and Viseyrs. Like the incestous, put Rhaenyra between us, weird brothers.

He never stood a chance, babies. He's the reason Rhaenys didn't sit the throne.

Y'all wanted him to be Maekar so bad, and I was never sure that he didn't sleep with Viserra, so.....

[natividadmoon]

The fact that Baelon allowed Viserys to consummate the marriage with a 13-year-old Aemma (not caring about the excuses you give me) already puts him on the same level for me, of perversity and evil of characters like Tywin and Viserys iii with Sansa and Daenerys respectively.

[fuhhhhhh]

the andal laws only apply when a women is benefiting from something .

the TG will always say that " Rhaenyra would't be recognised as queen because of andal law " But let me tell you something if andal law was applied back then Viserys would not be king Because :

By the andal law a man cannot have a second wife while he is married to his first wife . so , Visenya would be racognised as the legal wife of Aegon i not rhaenys that means by andal law Maegor would be Aegons rightful heir not Aenys because aegons , marriage with Rhaenys is not recognised as legal . So, that means Maegor did not usurp his Half-older brother because the throne is rightfully his .

After maegor died . Since , he did not have any children the throne will pass over to Aenys i but since he is died the throne will go to aegon the uncrowned but since he is also died the throne will pass over to his daughter princess Aerea by the andal law a daughter comes before an uncle {jaehaerys } Jaehaerys by the law tecnically he would be be recognised as a usurper .

So, after Jaehaerys i is king his heir is prince aemon but since prince aemon is dead the throne will pass over to his daughter princess rhaenys ii will be queen but the throne was pass over to prince baelon , so lets consider rhaenys was the heir then by the andal law ser leanor would be the king and since he married rhaenyra she will be the queen consort and since jacaerys is legally recognised as his son so he will be king .

So , by applying andal law in the above situation viserys is not even a candidate to be king it seems it only applys when a woman is benefiting from something , like rhaenyra who was recognised as her fathers heir for ten years straight .

by the andal law the above man would be recognised as usurpers who stole the crown from the rightful heir

[drakaripykiros130ac]

Can you believe that they not only ruined present—time characters, but also characters that have never appeared on the show?

Like Baelon and Alyssa.

They introduced a supposed bastard son of Baelon’s. Laughable. Baelon and Alyssa were madly in love with one another. They would have eyes for no one else. Baelon was never interested in any other woman. And even after Alyssa died, Baelon remained faithful and never remarried. Even when his younger sister, Viserra, threw herself at him, he refused her.

And then what they did to Alyssa…no comment.

[darklinaforever]

Wait... I just learned that in HOTD, they gave BAELON an illegitimate son ?! The same Baelon who was married to ALYSSA ?! Viserys and Daemon's father ?!

WHAT THE ACTUAL FUCK ?!

After changing the ages of Corlys' illegitimate sons to make it appear that he didn't cheat on Rhaenys (because the writers are obsessed with making them a couple goal for some stupid reasons... ?) and now making it appear that BAELON HAD AN ILLEGITIMATE CHILD ?!

Like @daenerysies said :

baelon’s…bastard…his? the same baelon who was head over heels in love with alyssa? the same baelon who never took another wife nor even looked at another woman after her death? the same baelon who’s sister couldn’t even convince him to take her to wife? vaegon having a bastard would be more believable.

I want to KILL these STUPID writers (can we even call them writers at this point ?) !

[survivinglifesstruggles]

Let us all be in agreement that no one, not on Team Green nor Team Black, wanted any besmirchment on the names of Baelon or Alyssa.

[silmarillaure]

Putting Targ males into tiers based on how much I like them.

I would plant my DNA in a crime scene for them:

Aemon the Pale Prince, Vaegon, Daeron the Daring, Jacaerys, Viserys II, Aemon the Dragonknight, Baelor Breakspear, Maester Aemon, Aegon V

I would kiss them:

Aegon II (after I give him a breath mint), Aemond, Daeron II, Maekar, Daeron the Drunken, Duncan, Viserys III

My happy vitamins:

Aenys, Baelon, Laenor, Lucerys, Aegon III, Aerys I, Valarr, Daeron son of Aegon V

They interest me, but I wouldn't say I like them:

Aegon I, Jaehaerys I, Daeron I, Baelor I, Daemon Blackfyre, Bloodraven, Rhaegar

Completely neutral:

Aegon the Uncrowned, Viserys son of Aenys, Joffrey, Rhaegel, Matarys, Aelor

Love to hate them:

Maegor, Viserys I, Aegon IV, Bittersteel, Aerion Brightflame, Aerys II

IDGAF:

Jaehaerys II

I'd pay to burn them alive they infuriate me so much:

Daemon the Rogue Prince

[agentrouka-blog]

Baelon/Alyssa literally give me creeps. Like ok if you want a lot of children good for you, I don't judge that, but the way Alyssa talked it seemed as if she believed her entire existence was to birth sons for her brother, and she had no purpose other than that. Ironically the people who stan her because she was a targaryen and a tomboy like Arya are also the one who criticize Sansa for not being 'feminist' enough. I laugh- 🤣

I find her complete convenience to the men around her suspicious, especially in the context of just how deeply harsh their parents were with the disappointing children.

In an atmosphere of deep misogyny, where even her favorite brother is at first bothered by her adoration because she is a girl, where her niece is rejected as heir because she is a girl, she just so happens to both reject other girls as worthy company, and also jubilantly embrace her role as back-up broodmare to the point of making a public spectacle of her sex life? She "mounts" her brother that she never had a choice but to marry like it's up to her own volition and makes sure everyone knows how much she is into it? How perfectly she fits into the role other people decided she should fill? That just so happens to be her natural inclination? She's not compensating for anything at all? But she's also totally not like those annoying other girls? Twenty sons, she wants to give Baelon but no girls? Girls who would also become broodmares, like Daella? But Alyssa was "made for" childbirth? No internalized misogyny anywhere in the vicinity? No?

Sure.

[queensof-my-heart]

[alicent-archive]

Rhaenyra and Alicent go to the Dragonpit to select a dragon egg for Aemma’s unborn baby. Up until that point, Rhaenyra had been the one selecting the eggs, but this time, she wants Alicent to pick one. Alicent selects a black egg, and the reason she picks it is because the colour reminds her of Rhaenyra’s riding clothes.

When Baelon dies, the egg is returned to the Dragonpit.

Once Alicent is heavily pregnant, Viserys mentions that an egg has to be chosen for the baby. Rhaenyra would’ve been the one choosing the egg, but Rhaenyra isn’t on talking terms with anyone.

Viserys chooses the egg instead, and when Alicent returns to her chambers, inside the fireplace is a black egg. Visery’s tells her that it was Baelon’s egg, and Alicent almost snaps and tells him that, yes, she knows it was Baelon’s egg. She had been the person to pick it.

She doesn’t snap. She smiles. And that’s that.

Alicent realises, looking at the egg, that Viserys didn’t choose an egg for her baby, he chose an egg for Aemma’s baby; for Baelon.

As if the prince was still alive, as if Baelon walked among them.

When the egg hatches, from inside squirms a golden, glimmering dragon.

It reminds Alicent of a certain yellow dragon she used to visit almost everyday.

When Aegon is old enough to say single words, he calls the dragon Sun.

When he’s old enough to understand sentences, he calls the dragon Sunfyre.

[deus-sema]

While I think it was unnecessary for the dragonseeds to have closer ties with the current Targs and an explanation about them being descended from ancestral Targs would have sufficed, it they had to go down the route of turning them into someone's bastards then why pick Baelon out of all people when Viserys himself was right there. We know he used to fool around in his youth and Ulf being Viserys' bastard son would have given him reason to hold a grudge against both Rhaenyra and Aegon. They had to drag poor Baelon into this mess smh.

[elanorar]

At this point, I just wish certain individuals in this fandom would read the damn text instead of making nonsensical or false claims about Aegon III’s inheritance because Fire and Blood clearly states that he inherited the throne through Rhaenyra.

Despite her name being erased from the line of succession, King Aegon III is listed as Rhaenyra’s heir, not Aegon II’s, and gets his title from her. As stated by the text, “Aegon III, Rhaenyra’s son”.

Similarily, Viserys I is also listed as King Jaehaerys’ grandson and heir, not Prince Baelon’s son, and Jaehaerys himself was listed as Aenys son and heir, not Maegor the Cruel’s, who reigned before him.

The paradox of the Dance is that although Rhaenyra was not recognized as the Queen, they still rely on her name to crown her son by calling him her heir and placing him in the line of succession.

"History doesn't remember blood, it remembers names," and history sure as hell remembered that Aegon III, Viserys II, and every other Targaryen King descended from Rhaenyra Targaryen.

[thecatsaesthetics]

I’ve also heard the fandom theorize that the father of Gael’s baby was Daemon. They were around the same age.

It’s certainly possible that it was Daemon.

I would say that the Jaehaerys, Baelon, Daemon and even Viserys were all possible fathers.

While I think Jaehaerys is the most likely culprit I think the next likely are Baelon or Daemon.

Baelon is built up in the book to be this amazing would have been king. He’s given a massive pass by the fandom and they tend to get really mad when you imply anything bad about him. But I am skeptical of him, he literally raised Viserys and Daemon. Neither of them turned out to be good men, and were especially cruel to the women in their lives. I also do not buy at all this Alyssa “pick me” Targaryen story we get told in fire and blood. It seems almost directly at odds with all the other stories of women (Alyssa Velaryon, Rhaena Targaryen, Aerea Targaryen, Alysanne Targaryen). If anything seems like “maester propaganda” it’s Alyssa Targaryen. And the fandom just eats it all up. But idk I just don’t buy fire and bloods romantic view of her and Baelon.

Plus somehow Viserra ended up drunk in Baelon’s bed. People use this as proof of Baelon’s virtue but why would Viserra think it was a good idea to do this? The whole story is odd and written in a way to make Baelon seem like this amazing guy. But he literally had his drunk naked teenage sister in his bed and sent her away coldly.

So yeah Baelon could have possibly fathered Gael’s baby. Plus Baelon’s name might be a clue, he is BAELon, which similar to Bael the Bard and Gael was officially said to have been impregnated by a traveling singer.

Now Daemon is another great suspect, especially since he had a thing for Valyrian maidens. He also had just been married to Rhea and was deeply unhappy in that marriage. Also Alysanne arranged the marriage, and ensured Daemon was sent away from court. This all happened around the same time as Gael’s pregnancy and disappearance.

While it fits Daemon’s MO, and would certainly make sense, I think it’s likely not what Martin intended. He LOVES Daemon, we have the whole God Eyes battle documented despite nobody living from the battle. If Martin had wanted to Daemon to be the father of Gael’s baby I think we would have had the whole thing written as such. He’s just too much of a Daemon fanboy to not have written another story for him.

So while I am okay with that headcanon, I think the likely suspects are Jaehaerys and Baelon. Both would have had access to Gael, neither would have faced consequences for assaulting her. I lean more towards Jaehaerys because it really does fit with his determination to sexually control his female family members pattern but Baelon also could have felt this way about his female family members.

[lemonhemlock]

What do you think would have happened if Baelon Targaryen (son of Viserys and Aemma) survived?

rhaenyra would never have been named heir then. she would have still held resentment for her father murdering her mother by forcing repeated pregnancies on her, perhaps her resentment would have been transferred to her brother as well. but ultimately a good marriage could have been arranged for her and she would have lived her life as a very privileged, rich lady.

viserys could have still needed a wife for a spare son, i imagine. that could have been alicent or not. i imagine that alicent being the mother of a future half-hightower king was a very attractive prospect for otto. in this scenario, alicent would only be mother to spare princes, but the possibility of her daughter marrying baelon and becoming queen herself could not be discounted. and, in any case, otto is a second son himself, so making his own daughter queen is still quite the deal for his branch of the family. but perhaps in this scenario their wedding would not have been so rushed and alicent not quite so traumatised by early motherhood.

all in all, this would have been a better prospect for the kingdom, since there would be no debate over the line of succession

[ride-thedragon]

Aemond claiming Vhagar gets a little more layered when you realise that her and Caraxes are the only dragons those girls have known properly when it comes to dragon bonds. Like Baela has moondancer, but Rhaena specifically is being ignored by her father for the most part because if she didn't hatch a dragon egg, that means she could claim a dragon which would mean going back to Westeros.

Which is something he's clearly avoiding. Laena has to comfort her saying there are many ways to claim a dragon because Rhaena thinks they'll abandon her for not having one.

So when the dragon her mother has had her entire life is 'stolen', the exact meaning is that that was her mother's dragon, she doesn't have the understanding that Aemond does of going to the dragonpit and looking for dragons to claim.

To her, Vhagar was a family dragon, her family specifically, and the best chance she would have to claim one like her mom said.

Again, her dad ignores her and makes it seem like there's some hierarchy when it comes to hatching dragons and claiming them and not hatching them at all simply because he doesn't want to go back. He doesn't want to help her claim a dragon in King's Landing because he's a selfish bitch.

Aemond does not see it that way because of a similar inferiority complex, that the world's largest dragon could help absolve, and because he has the understanding that dragons aren't inherited. He is also aware that he's at a funeral and that the reason Vhagar is unclaimed is that Rhaena is mourning her recently dead mother.

I think my point is to blame Daemon and Viserys for being evil little men really and giving their kids or facilitating environments where their kids feel inferior based on their own targeted perceptions based on nothing over dragons and dragon bonds. They are responsible.